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Junior Peeper
Location: Queens
Registered:: May 19, 2006
Posts: 702
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I hope all you you now see now what sort of a monster that has been created.

DOWN WITH THE ppp.
They are just another set of Mugabes!!!!

WE NEED FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
Knows the ropes Member
Location: India
Registered:: August 21, 2002
Posts: 6221
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Nah, he aint Mugabe, more like Bush pulling the plug on Al Jazeera in the US. Pfatt Boy and Hoyte was more like Mugade, bringing out chain gangs and holligans to intimdate and maime anyone who dares to stand up.
Member
Registered:: April 04, 2008
Posts: 2278
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Baseman,

You keep defending Jagdeo as not being like Mugabe, and while you may have a small point, the larger picture to look at is: precedent! We had a dictator or at least an autocrat in Guyana already. We know because we lived through it.

Once you see signs of a dictator lurking, you have a responsibiulity to start making noise. You cannot make noise and expect help if and when the dictator becomes a crushing monster bearing down on you.

No dictator starts out by telling people that he plans to become a dictator. It is people with discerning minds who pick up these things early on and start agitating. But when folks like you keep saying Jagdeo is not like Mugabe or Burnham or Hoyte, you are looking at the later stages of the game plan from the vantage point of the early stages and making your erroneous distinction.

For me, I'm looking at the entire process in retrospect and saying the man is walking down the same road as Burnham. He has not gotten to the later stages, but he is on his way. If he is not stopped now, it may be too late for most who are too busy to pay attention, or like you, unwilling or unable to be perceptive and discerning.

Where there is smoke, there is a likelihood that there is fire or some sort of burning taking place. I can only hope you are not seeing smoke and thinking it is dust or else you'll become charred.
Senior Member
Registered:: June 17, 2002
Posts: 12266
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Bla Bla Bla
Knows the ropes Member
Registered:: January 10, 2004
Posts: 5079
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quote:
Originally posted by Communicator:


Big difference:

The PPP has been democratically elected every time, the PNC were not.

To become a Dictator one needs to have the majority support of his race or tribe in the security force(s), the PPP does not have that.

I do not know how long the CNS should be of the air or if they should be off at all, however, if there were rules governing the way they should operate then they need to follow the rules or else pay the penalty.

Re-broadcasting an inflammatory statement even after being advised that the rules were being broken is unacceptable – if that was done.
Knows the ropes Member
Location: India
Registered:: August 21, 2002
Posts: 6221
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quote:
Originally posted by Communicator:
Baseman,

You keep defending Jagdeo as not being like Mugabe, and while you may have a small point, the larger picture to look at is: precedent! We had a dictator or at least an autocrat in Guyana already. We know because we lived through it.

Once you see signs of a dictator lurking, you have a responsibiulity to start making noise. You cannot make noise and expect help if and when the dictator becomes a crushing monster bearing down on you.

No dictator starts out by telling people that he plans to become a dictator. It is people with discerning minds who pick up these things early on and start agitating. But when folks like you keep saying Jagdeo is not like Mugabe or Burnham or Hoyte, you are looking at the later stages of the game plan from the vantage point of the early stages and making your erroneous distinction.

For me, I'm looking at the entire process in retrospect and saying the man is walking down the same road as Burnham. He has not gotten to the later stages, but he is on his way. If he is not stopped now, it may be too late for most who are too busy to pay attention, or like you, unwilling or unable to be perceptive and discerning.

Where there is smoke, there is a likelihood that there is fire or some sort of burning taking place. I can only hope you are not seeing smoke and thinking it is dust or else you'll become charred.



Communicator, you read some of my positions of the PPP and Jag. I try to be fair and objective and not rush to judgement or take extreme positions on anyone or any actions. One big difference is he has a term limit which, frankly speaking, seems too long anyway. If the great US could be successful with 2X4, so could Guyana. The Swiss changed the presiding member every year I believe and the are a progressive nation.

I agree that one should be on-guard against such actions and should push back, which you see many on this board, supporter and non-supported is doing. Eventhough un-plugging Sharma is excessive and unjust, clearly that is not a strategic move to now throw him into the "Mugabe" dust bin. Mugabe declared himself as president for life and "constitutionalized" it, like Pfatt Boy. Jag has not, but we should ensure he does not either.

Communicator, I know you are using if figuratively however, I believe using word like smoke, fire, charred is inappropriate in the context of Guyana. As i said, given the history and emotions of Guyana and it's politics, such word resonate like veiled incitement and threats to loot and burn. It drives people back into their polarized corners.
Member
Registered:: April 12, 2002
Posts: 2621
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quote:
Originally posted by politikalamity:
quote:
Originally posted by Communicator:


Big difference:

The PPP has been democratically elected every time, the PNC were not.

To become a Dictator one needs to have the majority support of his race or tribe in the security force(s), the PPP does not have that.

I do not know how long the CNS should be of the air or if they should be off at all, however, if there were rules governing the way they should operate then they need to follow the rules or else pay the penalty.

Re-broadcasting an inflammatory statement even after being advised that the rules were being broken is unacceptable – if that was done.


Polit,

If in fact that was the case , then I fully agree with you - everyone should abide the rules

However it is my understanding that there was no rebroadcast of the offending segment after the ABC wrote to CNS advising him of the infraction. Sharma immediately profferred a public apology and assured the ABC that there would be no further rebroadcast of the offending article. They accepted his apology, and also accepted his explanation that the rebroadcast prior to the ABC letter, was done by the program manager without his explicit knowledge. The ABC letter & reprimand, and Sharma's apology should have put a lid on the issue. However the President was not satisfied with that, and in his wisdom - perhaps more like a petulant child, decide to have a second kick at the can. There is absolutely no evidence that this Advisory body made any recomendation to the " Compitent Authority", in this case the President, as Min. Of Information for any further action in the matter. That, in my humble opinion is akin to double jepordy in a court of law. Further, the President, being the person to whom the offensive statements were directed, should exercise the wisdom, restraint and political astuteness to recuse himself from any sanctioning body. Common decency and protocol should accept nothing less in a democracy.
Knows the ropes Member
Location: India
Registered:: August 21, 2002
Posts: 6221
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quote:
Originally posted by Mara:
quote:
Originally posted by politikalamity:
Re-broadcasting an inflammatory statement even after being advised that the rules were being broken is unacceptable – if that was done.


Polit,

If in fact that was the case , then I fully agree with you - everyone should abide the rules

However it is my understanding that there was no rebroadcast of the offending segment after the ABC wrote to CNS advising him of the infraction. Sharma immediately profferred a public apology and assured the ABC that there would be no further rebroadcast of the offending article. They accepted his apology, and also accepted his explanation that the rebroadcast prior to the ABC letter, was done by the program manager without his explicit knowledge. The ABC letter & reprimand, and Sharma's apology should have put a lid on the issue. However the President was not satisfied with that, and in his wisdom - perhaps more like a petulant child, decide to have a second kick at the can. There is absolutely no evidence that this Advisory body made any recomendation to the " Compitent Authority", in this case the President, as Min. Of Information for any further action in the matter. That, in my humble opinion is akin to double jepordy in a court of law. Further, the President, being the person to whom the offensive statements were directed, should exercise the wisdom, restraint and political astuteness to recuse himself from any sanctioning body. Common decency and protocol should accept nothing less in a democracy.



Though I dont support the ban, i have to say that responsible organizations should excercise some degree of judgement without having to receive an official notification from the Govt. Most media do operate on this principle and try to stay well within the limits set forth on law. I think most of us would conclude, without referring to any law, that an explicit threat against someone and especially a head of state is unacceptable and for a responsible news org to be rebroadcasting, it is an abuse of their previledge and down-right iresponsible. This is made even more sensitive given the situation Guyana was is in. Sharma has been known for hurling personal insults at people, like poking fun at certain ministers over age-related illnesses. This kind of behavior in unbecoming of a responsible news org. We all sympathize with Sharma, and I do also, mainly because the outfit did serve as the voice of the grass-roots however, he has brought this onto himself and should shoulder part of the blame.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: baseman,
Junior Peeper
Registered:: April 01, 1999
Posts: 856
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Dictator: a person exercising absolute power, esp. a ruler who has absolute, unrestricted control in a government.

Dictatorship: A form of government in which the ruler is an absolute dictator (not restricted by a constitution or laws or opposition etc


These definitions fits Jagdeo and the PPP Government
Elite Member
Location: Brampton,ontario,Cda
Registered:: June 28, 2002
Posts: 29751
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quote:
Originally posted by Gupta:
Dictator: a person exercising absolute power, esp. a ruler who has absolute, unrestricted control in a government.

Dictatorship: A form of government in which the ruler is an absolute dictator (not restricted by a constitution or laws or opposition etc


These definitions fits Jagdeo and the PPP Government


The people elected him, twice..
Junior Peeper
Registered:: April 01, 1999
Posts: 856
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Yes, 52% of the the people elected this dictator and dictatorship PPP government. Sadly, the 48% who voted against and even the 52% of voted for the corrupt government have NO say until next elections on how the country is governed.
Elite Member
Location: Brampton,ontario,Cda
Registered:: June 28, 2002
Posts: 29751
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quote:
Originally posted by Gupta:
Yes, 52% of the the people elected this dictator and dictatorship PPP government. Sadly, the 48% who voted against and even the 52% of voted for the corrupt government have NO say until next elections on how the country is governed.


Confused aren't you??

It's called democracy!!

Next election will in 2011. Would the PPP be returned to power.. 65% of the people residing in Guyana thinks so!!
Junior Peeper
Registered:: April 01, 1999
Posts: 856
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Democracy: The common people, considered as the primary source of political power.

Clearly, this aint happening in Guyana.

An elected dictatorship closely fits this corrupt and incompetent PPP Government.
Member
Location: New York
Registered:: February 04, 2008
Posts: 1927
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In the eyes of many,democracy only extends to the holding of frequent and fair elections.
Knows the ropes Member
Location: India
Registered:: August 21, 2002
Posts: 6221
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quote:
Originally posted by Gupta:
Yes, 52% of the the people elected this dictator and dictatorship PPP government. Sadly, the 48% who voted against and even the 52% of voted for the corrupt government have NO say until next elections on how the country is governed.



How much elected Bush. Anyway, one should not get caught up in the symantics of ratios, this means squat in ethnically polarized nations like Guyana, Bosnia, Kosovo, etc. You need a governing model that bring in true and ligitinate participation of the "outnumbered" groups. This is an essential mechanism to gain cooperation and buy-in and and effective government.

I hear many PPPites throw around the ratio, well it's a cop-out to finding a real and sustainable political solution. You people need to think of the shoe being on the other foot. Baseman was also a victim of PNC prejudice however, baseman does not believe in an equal and opposite reaction to a wrong, as it in itself is also wrong, and as they say, two wrong dont make it right. Baseman is frequently accused of racism by the true racists, Caribj, Boneass, Benford, Marylin, etc. However, baseman is the first to tell you, and has been for a while, an inclusive governing model is needed in Guyana, not winner takes it all. I felt the PPP has failed Guyana in this area and should have move in this direction when they had the moral highground. Shame on your hero, CBJ for letting this happen to Guyana.
Elite Member
Location: ny
Registered:: July 12, 2002
Posts: 23307
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quote:
Originally posted by politikalamity:
quote:
Originally posted by Communicator:


To become a Dictator one needs to have the majority support of his race or tribe in the security force(s), the PPP does not have that.

.



1. What is this "inflammatory statement". Do you want to know or do you accept what the PPP says?

2. The PPP now controls the GDF. They had a majoer shake up llast year. The top echelon of the GDF and the PNC objected. NOTHING HAPPENED. Now many AfroGuyanese allege persecution at teh hands of the joint forces even a pastor in Linden who had his family harrassed, his property destroyed, no apologies or compensation. And of course no charges brought.
Elite Member
Location: ny
Registered:: July 12, 2002
Posts: 23307
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quote:
Originally posted by Ramakant_p:
quote:
Originally posted by Gupta:
Dictator: a person exercising absolute power, esp. a ruler who has absolute, unrestricted control in a government.

Dictatorship: A form of government in which the ruler is an absolute dictator (not restricted by a constitution or laws or opposition etc


These definitions fits Jagdeo and the PPP Government


The people elected him, twice..


Which people. ONE TRIBE!!!!!!!!
Senior Member
Registered:: June 17, 2002
Posts: 12266
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Gouveia clears the air
The Chief of Staff leveled some serious allegations against the critics of the helicopter strategy being implemented under his command.

I guess who the cap fits let them wear it. Well, I am the person that shared my views with a Stabroek News reporter on this issue. A colleague of mine commented that I was brave to be so open and frank with my views. I responded that I am open and frank because I am sure professionally about what I was saying, but more particularly I said that I am not brave, I am fearless.


I am fearless not because I am brave, but because I believe I have nothing to fear. I live in a country where freedom of expression is respected and no one will come knocking on my door to harm me because I am exercising my freedom of expression.
Elite Member
Location: Homeless in New York, Lil ABC dropout!
Registered:: March 22, 1999
Posts: 24203
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Gouveia is a PPP man?Big Grin
Elite Member
Location: Brampton,ontario,Cda
Registered:: June 28, 2002
Posts: 29751
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quote:
Originally posted by caribj:
quote:
Originally posted by politikalamity:
quote:
Originally posted by Communicator:


To become a Dictator one needs to have the majority support of his race or tribe in the security force(s), the PPP does not have that.

.



1. What is this "inflammatory statement". Do you want to know or do you accept what the PPP says?

2. The PPP now controls the GDF. They had a majoer shake up llast year. The top echelon of the GDF and the PNC objected. NOTHING HAPPENED. Now many AfroGuyanese allege persecution at teh hands of the joint forces even a pastor in Linden who had his family harrassed, his property destroyed, no apologies or compensation. And of course no charges brought.


I remember the daze when Burnham used to shake up the Police force and the army. He used to put criminals and Afro PNC party holders into high positions. Cheddi used to object the same way.. The Police army used to terrorized the PPP activists.. Where were you?
Elite Member
Location: Brampton,ontario,Cda
Registered:: June 28, 2002
Posts: 29751
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quote:
Originally posted by Terry Ishmael:
Gouveia is a PPP man?Big Grin


So what? Is that a crime.? meathead!!
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