I callin' all them sinners to join us in prayer for the goodwill and tolerance to prevail over all posters, drunk, pissing drunk, soon to be drunk or otherwise intoxicated.

May we remain respectful to the beliefs and sensibilities of all beings, those greater or lesser than ourselves.

May we remember to wash ourselves off shame and blame before we cast the same on others.

Peace...now who gon sing the hymn...sarry bhajan...quaseeda....all in one voice. Lets give thanks and praises....

like yo calling me to de forum:)

quote:

Originally posted by villo:
like yo calling me to de forum:)

Yes sir, all Jews are welcomed, open arms.

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by villo:
like yo calling me to de forum:)

Yes sir, all Jews are welcomed, open arms.

ok lets get a lil intelectual now - are jews really the chosen people selected by god himself?

quote:

Originally posted by villo:

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by villo:
like yo calling me to de forum:)

Yes sir, all Jews are welcomed, open arms.

ok lets get a lil intelectual now - are jews really the chosen people selected by god himself?

Villo bhai...lewwe get a lil practical hay...if we are all god's children, then why would He choose to call one superior and anodda inferior??? Why would one be chosen, and anodda relegated to second class??? Hence the answer is no the Jews are not the chosen ones.

quote:

to call one superior and anodda inferior

war war rumours of ah war .... de song juss jump in me me head

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by villo:

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by villo:
like yo calling me to de forum:)

Yes sir, all Jews are welcomed, open arms.

ok lets get a lil intelectual now - are jews really the chosen people selected by god himself?

Villo bhai...lewwe get a lil practical hay...if we are all god's children, then why would He choose to call one superior and anodda inferior??? Why would one be chosen, and anodda relegated to second class??? Hence the answer is no the Jews are not the chosen ones.

Bhai they gat some Muslims pun dis forum who tell me that they religion mek dem superior to de ress ah we infidels.

Amen

Is dat de way you welcoming me?

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by villo:
like yo calling me to de forum:)

Yes sir, all Jews are welcomed, open arms.

Since I come back in a fowl (note the spelling) mood..no food via Fedex here---may I start a question:
Per laker's words of wisdom...let us all be honest: personal honesty must overcome religious bias. If we can't do that, we are slaves to religions made up by man. My question: Karma is what you sow is what you reap (based on intention). Hindu. Buddhism and Sikhism have a little different take, not worth exploring now. In Judaism, Christianity and islam, there is a God who can forgive you if you do crap--again, there are little variances that are not worth exploring too much except to say that J.C. died for Andre's sins, Muhammad will intercede for me (I don't buy that) or the jews are chosen so they only get temp. suffering.
QUestion: WHich one of these beliefs PROMOTES a STRONGER SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY? I just want to see what people think. Spare me the tortuous religious ideas...I need an answer that is rational. Please.

I don't know if you can measure which one promotes a stronger sense of responsibility since their beliefs and actions are not apples and apples. In a way, they all try to accomplish the same goal through different teachings and encouragements. What is your take?

I waiting for others.

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
I waiting for others.

Me too. Since I am not so sure that any one can claim that they promotes stronger responsibilities. Take for instance, the Muslim believes that he is more responsible since he wakes up early to not miss his first prayer and go through the day trying to keep up all those rituals, including social, economical and political ones. The Hindu (at least from my dealings with them don't place so much emphasis on institutionalized religiousity but still focus on good and evil and glorifying God. The Christian, while they preach that they are saved not by works but by Grace, still have within their everyday life the responsibility of nurturing good relationships with God and fellow man (which can be claimed by all anyway). The Jew who is believed to be God's chosen people is always wondering why God continues to try them like He has been. They still have other responsibilities that also help to keep the smooth sailing of the world. In my opinion, it is difficult to say who is more responsible. We all have different roles. But then again, I am not even a student of this stuff, much less an expert. :)

quote:

QUestion: WHich one of these beliefs PROMOTES a STRONGER SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY? I just want to see what people think. Spare me the tortuous religious ideas...I need an answer that is rational. Please.

i dont believe one is more responsible than the other. the msg is the same across board, in my opinion.

but then again..."sense of responsiblity" in terms of what exactly?

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
Since I come back in a fowl (note the spelling) mood..no food via Fedex here---may I start a question:
Per laker's words of wisdom...let us all be honest: personal honesty must overcome religious bias. If we can't do that, we are slaves to religions made up by man. My question: Karma is what you sow is what you reap (based on intention). Hindu. Buddhism and Sikhism have a little different take, not worth exploring now. In Judaism, Christianity and islam, there is a God who can forgive you if you do crap--again, there are little variances that are not worth exploring too much except to say that J.C. died for Andre's sins, Muhammad will intercede for me (I don't buy that) or the jews are chosen so they only get temp. suffering.
QUestion: WHich one of these beliefs PROMOTES a STRONGER SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY? I just want to see what people think. Spare me the tortuous religious ideas...I need an answer that is rational. Please.

Bass, where were you??? Aitte...I know, I know you were busy and things. Since you were MIA the religious forum suffered from withdrawal symptoms. Hence I anointed myself Rabbi Laker. Shalom Khaleel.
Just to let you know you are in violation of not posting religiously ont he religious forum. This will be held against you on judgement day.

Now in terms of which of these beliefs promote a stronger sense of responsibility, I would say that that will be dictated by our religious upbringing. The way we rationalize the concept of Mercy, and the inculcations of hell and heaven, leaves us all shaking in our boots come judgment day...that is if you believe that. Now I would say in practical living, we live with consequences, of which the undesirable outcomes are called mistakes, and the desirable outcomes success. Is that Karma? Perhaps Expectations.....

See Karma is down to a scientific idea almost in that action= reaction. In Judaims it was this,until it became the chosen people misinterpretation. Christianity totally, as Kaz pointed, went for grace, and responsibility was put off through indulegences etc. In Islam, the idea was karma...and God's grace was not to be taken as an issue of forgetting about responsiblity since it says
whosoever does an atom's weight of evil shall see it." That is karma in an abrahamic sense.
But instead of the Muslims, when they went to India, learning from the concept of Karma how to interpret their conduct, as they had done in regards to Judaism and Christianity, they sought to oppose hinduism, thereby shtting off a good chance of learning and development.
What do I mean about responsibility? That thought about what you do. For if I believe in a forgiving god, I might be tempted to thinnk about repsntance later. In karma, that don't work. You do, you pay. End of story.
I am of course working with hinduism on the dharmic consciousness level, not on the guyana pandit level..no disrespect meant to pandits, but the Guyana pandit is often as idiotic as the average guyana mejee...neither having been formally trained.

quote:

Originally posted by laker:

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
Since I come back in a fowl (note the spelling) mood..no food via Fedex here---may I start a question:
Per laker's words of wisdom...let us all be honest: personal honesty must overcome religious bias. If we can't do that, we are slaves to religions made up by man. My question: Karma is what you sow is what you reap (based on intention). Hindu. Buddhism and Sikhism have a little different take, not worth exploring now. In Judaism, Christianity and islam, there is a God who can forgive you if you do crap--again, there are little variances that are not worth exploring too much except to say that J.C. died for Andre's sins, Muhammad will intercede for me (I don't buy that) or the jews are chosen so they only get temp. suffering.
QUestion: WHich one of these beliefs PROMOTES a STRONGER SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY? I just want to see what people think. Spare me the tortuous religious ideas...I need an answer that is rational. Please.

Bass, where were you??? Aitte...I know, I know you were busy and things. Since you were MIA the religious forum suffered from withdrawal symptoms. Hence I anointed myself Rabbi Laker. Shalom Khaleel.
Just to let you know you are in violation of not posting religiously ont he religious forum. This will be held against you on judgement day.

Now in terms of which of these beliefs promote a stronger sense of responsibility, I would say that that will be dictated by our religious upbringing. The way we rationalize the concept of Mercy, and the inculcations of hell and heaven, leaves us all shaking in our boots come judgment day...that is if you believe that. Now I would say in practical living, we live with consequences, of which the undesirable outcomes are called mistakes, and the desirable outcomes success. Is that Karma? Perhaps Expectations.....

Bhai, as part of my funded religion rsearch, I had to go to Memphis to ascertain if Allah will send Elvis to hell or not. All I came back with was 'love me tender." JS...could you explain wat dat mean?

Hay Khal...would you happen to have known Prof. MA Khan? He was from Nigg, taught at UG, then Fordham U....good man, real good man. May his sould forever rest in peace.

quote:

Originally posted by laker:
Hay Khal...would you happen to have known Prof. MA Khan? He was from Nigg, taught at UG, then Fordham U....good man, real good man. May his sould forever rest in peace.

Nah bhai. Did not have the honor of his acquaintance. When I first came here in '74, I lost contact with my community for a long long time....I wasn't even in TO...was out west...where there are few guyanese.

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
QUestion: WHich one of these beliefs PROMOTES a STRONGER SENSE OF RESPONSIBILITY? I just want to see what people think. Spare me the tortuous religious ideas...I need an answer that is rational. Please.

Whatever religion places humanity above all else. I would’ve said Buddhism but on second thought I think Buddhism offers a lot to the individual spiritually but I can’t say that it’s really proactive in its actions towards all of humanity (on third thought this may be a good thing.)

Are you referring to responsibility of the religion as a whole or the responsibility of the individual follower? I feel like I’m in philosophy class!

Lets go with the individual. Philosophy class. hmmm...isn't that the essence of hindu "religion"? U think those rishis were chupid? Why u think Alexander the great find him backside in India? And is a naked man mek him turn back? ANyway..back to the question..individual responsiblity.

BTW, I can't say whihc is right or wrong because this is a discussion among us...

Bwoy, in this question any "expert" is automatically a liar. There are only theories. At least on an earthly level.

quote:

Originally posted by ksazma:

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
I waiting for others.

Me too. Since I am not so sure that any one can claim that they promotes stronger responsibilities. Take for instance, the Muslim believes that he is more responsible since he wakes up early to not miss his first prayer and go through the day trying to keep up all those rituals, including social, economical and political ones. The Hindu (at least from my dealings with them don't place so much emphasis on institutionalized religiousity but still focus on good and evil and glorifying God. The Christian, while they preach that they are saved not by works but by Grace, still have within their everyday life the responsibility of nurturing good relationships with God and fellow man (which can be claimed by all anyway). The Jew who is believed to be God's chosen people is always wondering why God continues to try them like He has been. They still have other responsibilities that also help to keep the smooth sailing of the world. In my opinion, it is difficult to say who is more responsible. We all have different roles. But then again, I am not even a student of this stuff, much less an expert. :)

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
Lets go with the individual. Philosophy class. hmmm...isn't that the essence of hindu "religion"? U think those rishis were chupid? Why u think Alexander the great find him backside in India? And is a naked man mek him turn back? ANyway..back to the question..individual responsiblity.

Morning or Asalaam Walaikum (I hope dem "bais" ain't vex ah greet you like dis) I find the question quite interesting and it's worthy of a 20 (or more) paged paper after solid research. Right now I ain't got de time fuh duh as I already ain't putting enough effort into my Engg class. But I could possibly answer this by mid- July. :) I do think (as you said as a layperson) that Buddhism would be the one that most strenuously espouses individual responsibility.


In addition, responsibility has so many meanings, the fuss section of the paper would be to define individual responsibility as pertains to the question. Then we have to deal with if the responsibility is a result of fear or future consequences or is it simply because it is righteous w/o expecting any reward.

quote:

Originally posted by Petal29:

quote:

Originally posted by khaleel:
Lets go with the individual. Philosophy class. hmmm...isn't that the essence of hindu "religion"? U think those rishis were chupid? Why u think Alexander the great find him backside in India? And is a naked man mek him turn back? ANyway..back to the question..individual responsiblity.

Morning or Asalaam Walaikum (I hope dem "bais" ain't vex ah greet you like dis) I find the question quite interesting and it's worthy of a 20 (or more) paged paper after solid research. Right now I ain't got de time fuh duh as I already ain't putting enough effort into my Engg class. But I could possibly answer this by mid- July. :) I do think (as you said as a layperson) that Buddhism would be the one that most strenuously espouses individual responsibility.


In addition, responsibility has so many meanings, the fuss section of the paper would be to define individual responsibility as pertains to the question. Then we have to deal with if the responsibility is a result of fear or future consequences or is it simply because it is righteous w/o expecting any reward.

Hmmm..while you profess NOt to be a specialist, the questions you raise are interesting, and yes, it could lead to a 20 pp paper. This is why I sort of pushed Budd and Sikh away and opted more for the Hindu take. U are right about Buddhism in general, except in Buddhism, the majority type is Mahayana which knows the concept of the Boddhisatva that can assist humans. In Hinduism, the equation is much simpler, the basic karmic construct...each action=reaction.
My personal take (just an opinion, not a verdict) is that the hindu concept is far more dynamic. Don't rely on a forgiving god, don't