Saudi is on Wed
Some masjids are thursday
And ICNA is now saying Friday.
Bear in mind the pilgrims are gathering on the day of Arafat on Tuesday and we non pilgrims are supposed to fast on that day.

We are celebrating it on Friday using local sighting. Saudi is a farce.
In future, we should all use local sighting. This will eliminate all confusion.

quote:

Originally posted by Terry Ishmael:
We are celebrating it on Friday using local sighting. Saudi is a farce.
In future, we should all use local sighting. This will eliminate all confusion.

I srongly feel that we should go with Saudi.
The local people who are responsible to make that decision is as confusing as the Saudis.
1am in the morning they are calling from Chicago saying the new moon has just been sighted.
Brother in this day an age we are looking real stupid for not being on the same page.
I remebered what you said last year, that no matter how hard we try, each side will bring mountain of eveidence to try to justfy thier position, be it local, international or calculations.

Less confusion when you do it yourself. Saudis are not reliable. They are the ones who look stupid, not us.

The first country to see the moon should be Australia. Ask any Saudi if they will follow Australia. If the Saudis are making a mockery of this, I see no reason why we should be following them.

It is almost meaningless to try to reason with some of you. The hajj is a TOPOCOSMIC rite. I know you can check what that means. Whether you like the saudis or not, then Chief is right.
I already explained that the issue is not what Saudi says, but what the SCHOLARS say..and they are NOT restricted to saudi, but the entire gulf etc. So what we have is a bunch of USULi (the highest study in Islam) saying one thing, a bunch of non-usulis saying something else....
This is nonsense and the Qur'an goes AGAINST it which is why it talks about "ummiyoon la ya'lamun al kitab." I shall leave this alone.

I am with the Saudis here. Our masjid is doing this on Wednesday. :)

quote:

Originally posted by Chief:
Saudi is on Wed
Some masjids are thursday
And ICNA is now saying Friday.
Bear in mind the pilgrims are gathering on the day of Arafat on Tuesday and we non pilgrims are supposed to fast on that day.

What does tuesday have to do with wednesday, thursday and friday?

quote:

I am with the Saudis here. Our masjid is doing this on Wednesday. :)

you bahind should go Saturday just to prove your point :):):)

quote:

Originally posted by dara shikoh:
It is almost meaningless to try to reason with some of you. The hajj is a TOPOCOSMIC rite. I know you can check what that means. Whether you like the saudis or not, then Chief is right.
I already explained that the issue is not what Saudi says, but what the SCHOLARS say..and they are NOT restricted to saudi, but the entire gulf etc. So what we have is a bunch of USULi (the highest study in Islam) saying one thing, a bunch of non-usulis saying something else....
This is nonsense and the Qur'an goes AGAINST it which is why it talks about "ummiyoon la ya'lamun al kitab." I shall leave this alone.

Bannas you are the scholar however Ihave been saying this for years.

Did the Saudis see the moon before they announce their decision????? Stop al the babbling and answer this question. My sallam to all.

quote:

Originally posted by Chief:

quote:

Originally posted by Terry Ishmael:
We are celebrating it on Friday using local sighting. Saudi is a farce.
In future, we should all use local sighting. This will eliminate all confusion.

I srongly feel that we should go with Saudi.
The local people who are responsible to make that decision is as confusing as the Saudis.
1am in the morning they are calling from Chicago saying the new moon has just been sighted.
Brother in this day an age we are looking real stupid for not being on the same page.
I remebered what you said last year, that no matter how hard we try, each side will bring mountain of eveidence to try to justfy thier position, be it local, international or calculations.

you all will continue to look stupid as long as al yu decide to follow anything other that the instructions given to us by the most high. Be a follower of our holy prophet(pbuh) not the Saudis.

Ow Mikey I know what you saying but ..........it's the but is the problem(winkeye)

quote:

Originally posted by SuperMike:
Did the Saudis see the moon before they announce their decision????? Stop al the babbling and answer this question. My sallam to all.

If u read properly, you will see that they cal. method means they DON"T have to see the moon.

quote:

Originally posted by SuperMike:

quote:

Originally posted by Chief:

quote:

Originally posted by Terry Ishmael:
We are celebrating it on Friday using local sighting. Saudi is a farce.
In future, we should all use local sighting. This will eliminate all confusion.

I srongly feel that we should go with Saudi.
The local people who are responsible to make that decision is as confusing as the Saudis.
1am in the morning they are calling from Chicago saying the new moon has just been sighted.
Brother in this day an age we are looking real stupid for not being on the same page.
I remebered what you said last year, that no matter how hard we try, each side will bring mountain of eveidence to try to justfy thier position, be it local, international or calculations.

you all will continue to look stupid as long as al yu decide to follow anything other that the instructions given to us by the most high. Be a follower of our holy prophet(pbuh) not the Saudis.

We can only follow the prophet when we understand the Qur'an..which talks of time being dictated by the planetary movement..a scientific fact, but such movement need not be SEEN, as it can be calculated. That is islam=science. Anything else is islam=tradition=and if it is said to them follow what allah has revealed, they say rather we would follow that which we found our fathers doing. the rest of the ayah goes further, check it out. Ma salaam I gone for the next few days.

Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

Now back to my question. If Australia declares Eid before any other country, will Saudi or will you accept the decision?

quote:

If u read properly, you will see that they cal. method means they DON"T have to see the moon.

Thats where you pissin in the wind. The Sauids calculate the birth of the new moon and claim it as the sighting of the new moon.

Us folks here in North America, calculate the sighting of the new moon, hence the one day difference.

That is the crux of the matter. It is a very simple thing to fix if dem asses in Arabia would listen to dem asses here in North America.

The problem is nobody want to listen including dara the skulla.

quote:

Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

The movement can be calculate, the sighting cannot be done to a high level of accuracy. Hence the saudi decision to use the birth which can be calculated to perfection.

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

The movement can be calculate, the sighting cannot be done to a high level of accuracy. Hence the saudi decision to use the birth which can be calculated to perfection.

so the Saudis are totally disregarding sighting..and if so it this OK.Let's ask ourselves how did the Rasool(pbuh) did it....and try our best to follow that which he did...is this fair?

quote:

Originally posted by SuperMike:

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

The movement can be calculate, the sighting cannot be done to a high level of accuracy. Hence the saudi decision to use the birth which can be calculated to perfection.

so the Saudis are totally disregarding sighting..and if so it this OK.Let's ask ourselves how did the Rasool(pbuh) did it....and try our best to follow that which he did...is this fair?

wha you think go happen if they come out and say it in public.

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

Originally posted by SuperMike:

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

The movement can be calculate, the sighting cannot be done to a high level of accuracy. Hence the saudi decision to use the birth which can be calculated to perfection.

so the Saudis are totally disregarding sighting..and if so it this OK.Let's ask ourselves how did the Rasool(pbuh) did it....and try our best to follow that which he did...is this fair?

wha you think go happen if they come out and say it in public.

nothing rite :)

quote:

Originally posted by Terry Ishmael:
Apparently the movement of the moon cannot be calculated, because we see different countries with different calculations, and none can agree with each other's calculations.
Did you notice Saudi Arabia is always the first to declare Eid?

Now back to my question. If Australia declares Eid before any other country, will Saudi or will you accept the decision?

That is an empty claim that denies reason. YOU have to prove this. There is a standard meteorological/astronomical calculation that I hae not seen vary. The US naval observatory, by the way, is what the saudis used back in the day..I dont know now.

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

If u read properly, you will see that they cal. method means they DON"T have to see the moon.

Thats where you pissin in the wind. The Sauids calculate the birth of the new moon and claim it as the sighting of the new moon.

Us folks here in North America, calculate the sighting of the new moon, hence the one day difference.

That is the crux of the matter. It is a very simple thing to fix if dem asses in Arabia would listen to dem asses here in North America.

The problem is nobody want to listen including dara the skulla.

Once again..I dealt with this alrady if you reread: i said that it is possible that the saudis are saying "sighting" to please some masses...but I have no proof of that. If your statement is correct..and none has proven it to be so, then certainly they are to be chided for their METHOD of declaration. This does not mean that their calculation is wrong. There is a big difference.
As for terry's question: it is illogical since australia would necc. be a day ahead. Sunday here is monday there. And calculations already take this into account. Geez..a simple thijng like this one has to discuss at length? No doubt the scholars..most mideastern ones..refuse to answer questions sometimes

so the Saudis are totally disregarding sighting..and if so it this OK.Let's ask ourselves how did the Rasool(pbuh) did it....and try our best to follow that which he did...is this fair?[/QUOTE]
No Mike. YOur sentiment as regards sunnah is fine. BUt it is not an umbrella concept. He rode a camel..we use cars. He prayed for rain, we know now that silver nitrate helps. We work in conjunction with modernity and science. WE are the ones who discovered the sciences for advanced astronomy etc. For a reason..the early muslims realised the necc. of science to alleviate certain dated practices.

quote:

Originally posted by Abu Jihad:

quote:

I am with the Saudis here. Our masjid is doing this on Wednesday. :)

you bahind should go Saturday just to prove your point :):):)

Cyar yuh backside theh. :))